CLEANED UP VERSION: DEBATE Eric Allen Bell vs Nadir Ahmed – “Is Islam Inherently Violent?”

Qur'an:9:29 - "Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."

Qur'an:8:39 - "So fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief [non-Muslims]) and all submit to the religion of Allah alone (in the whole world)."

Bukhari:8:387 - "Allah's Apostle said, 'I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah.'

******AND "ALLAHS" STATED PURPOSE FOR ISLAM******

Qur’an 48:28a - "He it is Who hath sent His messenger with the guidance and the religion of truth, that He may cause it to prevail over all religion."

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In 98 I was working evening shift and seen a late night commercial offering a free Koran. Because I have an interest in all religions, especially Christian Cults, I ordered it and read it even though it was a very difficult read. I noticed peaceful verses and violent verses but did not know what to make of it all. Then after 911 I read the Koran again and this time I discovered a verse that talked about later verses superseding earlier verses. But I did not know which where early and later verses. Even after this and 911 I still believed that Islam was not a big concern for me as the only ones blowing things up where “terrorist” and not all Muslims where terrorist, right? Then came 9/09/10, it was the day that changed my life and mission. Because I have Mormons, Oneness Pentecostals, Word of Faithers and Bible Missionaries in my family, I had devoted the last 10 years to Christian Cult Apologetics, and then came along Pastor Terry Jones, needless to say him and his Burn a Koran day changed my life. Here is why.

On 9/9/10 I visited a friends political blog and seen a post about the Burn a Koran Day. I’m not really sure why but I thought, this jerk could to set the whole world ablaze if he burns them Korans. I visited Jones site and also went to his facebook page and a facebook page that was against the Koran burning. What I seen shocked me. It went like this,,,”we will kill you all if you burn our Koran”,, and non Muslims responded by saying,,, “not if we kill you all first”.

The non-muslims where posting videos of Muslims burning people alive, beheading people, stoning people, hanging people, beating women,,etc. I had seen a couple of these videos but had no idea there where so many. And of course on 9/11 they was showing all the tributes on TV which included the jumpers from the towers, I was really overwhelmed but still spent a total of five days on those facebook pages. One day as soon as I awoke, it dawned on me that I never seen a single Muslim denounce those atrocious videos without also half heartedly justifying them. And many Muslims outright condoned the terrible acts. That day I noticed that far to many of the ones who condoned such acts where living in the west. I knew right then that there are not as many “moderate Muslims” as myself and most people thought. I decided that day that I would be changing the focus of my ministry and dedicating my life to studying Islam and telling others about it’s dangers. I started this blog on Islam and I plan on doing counter-jihad work until I die.

MANAGER,

Damon Whitsell

America is indeed exceptional -- a once-in-history success militarily, economically, scientifically and culturally.

THE FALSE CONCEPT OF ISLAMOPHOBIA IS USED TO SILENCE TALK ABOUT ISLAM AND TO QUELL DISCENT.

"These future United States presidents questioned the ambassador as to why his government was so hostile to the new American republic even though America had done nothing to provoke any such animosity. Ambassador Adja answered them, as they reported to the Continental Congress, 'that it was founded on the Laws of their Prophet, that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as Prisoners, and that every Musselman who should be slain in Battle was sure to go to Paradise'." Thomas Jefferson to the Continental Congress about the brutal pirate attacks of the Muslim Ottoman Barbary States which prompted the first two wars of the newly independent United States of America, - the Barbary Wars. (1801–1805 and 1815)

Mahomet established a religion by putting his enemies to death; Jesus Christ by commanding his followers to lay down their lives. Blaise Pascal

"I am afraid that God has sent these men to lay waste the world". Gregory Palamus of Thessalonica, 1354: While negotiating the surrender of Alexandria to the Muslims.

“Islam makes it incumbent on all adult males, provided they are not disabled and incapacitated, to prepare themselves for the conquest of [other] countries so that the writ of Islam is obeyed in every country in the world. But those who study Islamic Holy War will understand why Islam wants to conquer the whole world…. Those who know nothing of Islam pretend that Islam counsels against war. Those [who say this] are witless. Islam says Kill all the unbelievers just as they would kill you all! Does this mean that Muslims should sit back until they are devoured by [the unbelievers] Islam says Kill them [the non-Muslims], put them to the sword and scatter [their armies]. Does this mean sitting back until [non-Muslims] overcome us Islam says Kill in the service of Allah those who may want to kill you! Does this mean that we should surrender to the enemy Islam says Whatever good there is exists thanks to the sword and in the shadow of the sword! People cannot be made obedient except with the sword! The sword is the key to Paradise, which can be opened only for Holy Warriors! There are hundreds of other [Koranic] verses and Hadiths [sayings of the Prophet] urging Muslims to value war and to fight. Does all that mean that Islam is a religion that prevents men from waging war I spit upon those foolish souls who make such a claim.” Ayatollah Khomeini 1942.

“During the thousand years that included the careers of the Frankish soldier and the Polish king, the Christians of Asia and Africa proved unable to wage successful war with the Moslem conquerors; and in consequence Christianity practically vanished from the two continents; and today nobody can find in them any "social values" whatever, in the sense in which we use the words, so far as the sphere of Mohammedan influence. There are such "social values" today in Europe, America, and Australia only because during those thousand years the Christians of Europe possessed the warlike power to do what the Christians of Asia and Africa had failed to do - that is, to beat back the Moslem invader.” Theodore Roosevelt.

"Ever since the religion of Islam appeared in the world, the espousers of it...have been as wolves and tigers to all other nations, rending and tearing all that fell into their merciless paws, and grinding them with their iron teeth; that numberless cities are raised from the foundation, and only their name remaining; that many countries, which were once as the garden of God, are now a desolate wilderness; and that so many once numerous and powerful nations are vanished from the earth! Such was, and is at this day, the rage, the fury, the revenge, of these destroyers of human kind". John Wesley (1703-91)

In the seventh century of the Christian era, a wandering Arab of the lineage of Hagar, the Egyptian, combining the powers of transcendent genius, with the preternatural energy of a fanatic, and the fraudulent spirit of an impostor, proclaimed himself as a messenger from Heaven, and spread desolation and delusion over an extensive portion of the earth. Adopting from the sublime conception of the Mosaic law, the doctrine of one omnipotent God; he connected indissolubly with it, the audacious falsehood, that he was himself his prophet and apostle. Adopting from the new Revelation of Jesus, the faith and hope of immortal life, and of future retribution, he humbled it to the dust, by adapting all the rewards and sanctions of his religion to the gratification of the sexual passion. He poisoned the sources of human felicity at the fountain, by degrading the condition of the female sex, and the allowance of polygamy; and he declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind. THE ESSENCE OF HIS DOCTRINE WAS VIOLENCE AND LUST: TO EXALT THE BRUTAL OVER THE SPIRITUAL PART OF HUMAN NATURE.

The precept of the koran is, perpetual war against all who deny, that Mahomet is the prophet of God. The vanquished may purchase their lives, by the payment of tribute; the victorious may be appeased by a false and delusive promise of peace; and the faithful follower of the prophet, may submit to the imperious necessities of defeat: but the command to propagate the Moslem creed by the sword is always obligatory, when it can be made effective. The commands of the prophet may be performed alike, by fraud, or by force. John Quincy Adams

Nor can the Plundering of Infidels be in that sacred Book [the Quran] forbidden, since it is well known from it, that God has given the World, and all that it contains, to his faithful Mussulmen, who are to enjoy it of Right as fast as they conquer it. Ben Franklin

"Individual Muslims may show splendid qualities, but the influence of the religion paralysis the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Muhammadanism is a militant and proselytizing faith." - Winston Churchill

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy. The effects are apparent in many countries. Improvident habits, lovenly systems of agriculture, sluggish methods of commerce, and insecurity of property exist wherever the followers of the Prophet rule or live. A degraded sensualism deprives this life of its grace and refinement; the next of its dignity and sanctity.

The fact that in Mohammedan law every woman must belong to some man as his absolute property, either as a child, a wife, or a concubine, must delay the final extinction of slavery until the faith of Islam has ceased to be a great power among men. Individual Moslems may show splendid qualities - but the influence of the religion paralyses the social development of those who follow it. No stronger retrograde force exists in the world. Far from being moribund, Mohammedanism is a militant and proselytizing faith. It has already spread throughout Central Africa, raising fearless warriors at every step; and were it not that Christianity is sheltered in the strong arms of science, the science against which it had vainly struggled, the civilization of modern Europe might fall, as fell the civilization of ancient Rome." WINSTON CHURCHILL ON ISLAM - IN 1899!

"The true Islamic concept of peace goes something like this: "Peace comes through submission to Muhammad and his concept of Allah" (i.e. Islam). As such the Islamic concept of peace, meaning making the whole world Muslim, is actually a mandate for war. It was inevitable and unavoidable that the conflict would eventually reach our borders, and so it has." Vernon Richards

"Among religions, Bolshevism is to be reckoned with Muhammadanism rather than with Christianity and Buddhism, Christianity and Buddhism are primarily personal religions, with mystical doctrines and a love of contemplation. Muhammadanism and Bolshevism are practical, social, unspiritual (doctrines), concerned to win the empire of this world." - Professor Bertrand Russell (Philosopher)

"Muslims are the first victims of Islam. Many times I have observed in my travels that fanaticism comes from a small number of dangerous men who maintain others in the practice of this religion by terror. To liberate the Muslim from his religion is the best service that one can render him". - Earnest Renan (French Thinker)

"The Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex of order and freedom, culture and peace, can at any moment be overthrown by barbarians invading from without or multiplying within." - Will Durant (U.S. Historian)

"Muhammadanism fell far short. In this case the projections were of violence predominating. Love and kinship were secondary to what indeed amounted to baptism and communion through violence and blood...

...So the concept of God began to change as the ego recognized its reliance upon inner reality, but the drama had to be worked out within the current framework.

Muhammadanism was basically so violent precisely because Christianity was basically so gentle. Not that Christianity was not mixed with violence, or that Muhammadanism was devoid of love. But the psyche went through its developments and battled with itself, denying some feelings and characteristics and stressing others, so the historic religious exterior dramas represented and followed these inner aspirations, struggles, and searches." - Jane Roberts, Seth (20th Century Spiritualism)

“Having thus given a cursory view of the Qur'an, I lay it before the sensible persons with the purpose that they should know what kind of book the Qur'an is. If they ask me, I have no hesitation to say that it can not be the work either of God or of a learned man, nor can it be a book of knowledge. Here its very vital defect has been exposed with the object that the people may not waste their life falling into its imposition…

... The Qur'an is the result of ignorance, the source of animalization of human being, a fruitful cause of destroying peace, an incentive to war, a propagator of hostility among men and a promoter of suffering in society. As to defect of repetition, the Qur'an is its store.” - Maharishi Swami Dayanand Saraswati (19th Century Indian Sage and Rational Reformer)

"Over a billion people believe in Allah without truly knowing what Allah supposedly stands for or what he really demands of them. And the minority that do understand continue to be Moslems because they have redefined their morality and ethics to fit within the teachings of Islam, which are floridly lacking in morality. They therefore redefine what is good and evil in order to fit their lives into what is preached by Islam, instead of examining Islam to see if it fits within the good life. Backwards thinking, imposed by a backward religion". - Professor Bertrand Russell

"Show me just what Prophet Muhammad brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Pope Benedict/Byzantine Emperor Paleogus

“The world is a dangerous place, not because of those who do evil, but because of those who look on and do nothing.” – Albert Einstein

Father, I pray You prevent the destructive forces of terrorism directed against our nations. Provide protection from evil attacks and stop the aggressors that attempt to bring destruction to our nation and its people. May Your Hand of protection keep us safe.

I stand against the spirit of fear that accompanies the cowardice acts of terrorism. Allow our fear to turn to trust in You. May knowledge of terrorist planned attacks be revealed to those who provide our national and international security. Help those in power to act swiftly to avert all danger, protecting American lives and property.

Lord, provide strength, courage, and wisdom to our protectors. Give wisdom and insight to our government and everyone involved in the elimination of terrorism. Provide instruction in the development of effective and efficient anti-terrorist strategies that will give us an advantage against our aggressors, allowing this country to remain safe and secure.

I also pray that You enter the hearts of the instigators of terrorism, so they recognize the evil of their ways, and repent and denounce their cowardice acts of destruction against humanity. Without repentance, may they reap the consequences of their actions through Your Divine Justice. May the fear of our retaliation be greater than their hatred of democracy. Guide us in efforts to seek out and erradicate these merchants of death. Reveal to us the names of those responsible and in allegiance with terrorist organizations. Enable our military to become swift, powerful, and accurate in any action of retaliation. Help them keep the innocent safe as they stop these evil people.

Lord, help us to understand lifestyle changes that might be necessary to ensure our protection. Grant patience and tolerance to us in adapting to the safety precautions and measure that we might experience. Enable us to realize that the cost of inconvenience is a small price to pay for the safety of our families.

Amen.
PRAYER TAKEN FROM HERE